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john

United Kingdom
608 Posts

Posted - 11/06/2007 :  22:19:31  Show Profile  Visit john's Homepage  Send john an AOL message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by commonsense

John - Vitamin C reacts and interacts with living sytems by means of well researched and documented biological and chemical principals, just like any other biologically-active compound. I challenge you to explain, in your own words, scientifically, how these mechanisms differ from the biomechanical action of any 'allopathic' molecule.regards cs


Vitamin C works, while allopathic drugs don't, simple. We may suffer from lack of vitamin C but not lack of pharma drugs http://www.whale.to/a/rath.html

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commonsense

178 Posts

Posted - 11/06/2007 :  22:39:25  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Vitamin C works, while allopathic drugs don't, simple. We may suffer from lack of vitamin C but not lack of pharma drugs http://www.whale.to/a/rath.html


Can you elborate in more detail how Vitamin C differs from 'allopathic' molecules with regard to biomechanical action?

cs

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GUS THE FUSS

United Kingdom
1469 Posts

Posted - 11/06/2007 :  23:10:38  Show Profile  Visit GUS THE FUSS's Homepage  Reply with Quote
No- commonsense there is no such thing as allopathic molecules forget the rest of the question…

Allopathic ,Allopathy or Allopathic medicine as the treatment of disease using conventional medical therapies, as opposed to the use of alternative medical or non-conventional therapies
Homeopathy is a scientific and natural system of healing that aims to treat the whole person by using natural remedies that boost the body’s own ability to heal and correct any imbalances. Based on the Law of Similars, a homeopath seeks to find a substance which, in overdose, would mimic symptoms akin to those a sick person is experiencing.

When the match is made, that substance is given to the patient in minute, safe doses.

Dr Samuel Hahnemann was the first to observe that plant, animal and herb substances capable of causing disease in healthy people can be used in diluted form to treat people with similar symptoms. Based on this observation, a process of dilution and ‘potentisation’ was developed to make homeopathic remedies.

A homeopathic remedy consists of a ’signature’ from a particular substance, such as a plant.
To obtain this signature the plant substance is diluted with 99 parts distilled water or ethyl alcohol. This is repeated many times over. This process of dilution is accompanied by a procedure called succussion, which imprints the energetic signature of the plant on the water molecules.

It is this signature that gets carried through and potentised. As the plant molecules decrease with continued dilution, the signature gets stronger until the remedy has no measurable trace of the plant left.

Thus the remedy is potent without any toxicity.

According to homeopath and general practitioner Dr David Nye, homeopathy needs to be differentiated from herbal treatment, which is also natural but not always safe.

‘With herbs you are using a plant in a natural form and it is having a physiological effect on the body’ he says. ‘Herbs can increase the heart rate or decrease breast milk … they can have many different specific effects on the physiology of the body.

But because of the way the homeopathic remedy has been potentised and diluted, it no longer works at the physiological level.’

‘Homeopathy works on a vibrational or energetic level in the body’.
Nye says that although some of the substances used to make homeopathic remedies are toxic in their undiluted state, once they have been through the processes of dilution and potentisation they are 100% sate and have few side effects if administered correctly.

How do homeopathy and allopathy differ in terms of diagnosis?

In a homeopathic consultation, the homeopath takes a detailed case history not only of the patient’s symptoms, but also of his development milestones, personality likes and dislikes, fears and general behavior.

Using all this information, he will prescribe one or more remedies, the drug picture of which most closely matches the total picture of the patient.

The expected outcome is not only relief of symptoms hut a cure from the inside out.
… and in treatment?

The word “allopathy” means treating by opposites, while “homeopathy” means treating by the same.

‘In conventional medicine, if you have an infection you would use an antibiotic. If you have an inflammation, you would lake an anti-inflammatory - you treat with the opposite of your condition.

When the body displays symptoms, conventional medicine attempts to suppress or counteract those symptoms.’
‘Homeopathy is a wonderful method of treatment because it has few side effects and works very quickly especially in babies because their systems are clean’, Nye maintains.

He believes homeopathy can treat most conditions and, in the case of babies, is effective in dealing with teething problems, nappy rash, colic and other day-to-day ailments, as well as more serious illnesses such as recurring colds, chest infections, ear infections, tonsillitis, lever, diarrhea and vomiting.


Edited by - GUS THE FUSS on 11/06/2007 23:19:19
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Jonathon Whitlock-Masters

United Kingdom
14 Posts

Posted - 11/07/2007 :  10:08:43  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by john

quote:
Originally posted by commonsense

John - Vitamin C reacts and interacts with living sytems by means of well researched and documented biological and chemical principals, just like any other biologically-active compound. I challenge you to explain, in your own words, scientifically, how these mechanisms differ from the biomechanical action of any 'allopathic' molecule.regards cs


Vitamin C works, while allopathic drugs don't, simple. We may suffer from lack of vitamin C but not lack of pharma drugs http://www.whale.to/a/rath.html



Avoiding the question again john? How do the mechanisms differ?
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Jonathon Whitlock-Masters

United Kingdom
14 Posts

Posted - 11/07/2007 :  10:23:28  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Homeopathy works on a vibrational or energetic level in the body

Hahahahaha, which is it Gus - vibrational or energetic? You and Nye don't seem to be too sure. Can you define 'vibrational or energetic level'? What kind of energy is it? What is vibrating? Can you answer these questions or are you just parroting lines from a homeopath?
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commonsense

178 Posts

Posted - 11/07/2007 :  10:45:42  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
So do you use vitamin C in homeopathic doses? Because obviously that would be better than measureable doses...

And for those of you that think that using homeopathy and herbalism to the exclusion of seeing someone who knows what they are talking about:

http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,22706946-5001021,00.html
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Wanda

United Kingdom
133 Posts

Posted - 11/07/2007 :  11:09:24  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
Commonsense - the final line of that report states, "The inquest continues". So, before a conclusion is reached you have made some kind of assumption which only you can know. Watch that space, read all about it, then post on here to tell me how right you had been. Seems to me you have not lived up to your name on this occasion.
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john

United Kingdom
608 Posts

Posted - 11/07/2007 :  11:22:49  Show Profile  Visit john's Homepage  Send john an AOL message  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by commonsense

So do you use vitamin C in homeopathic doses? Because obviously that would be better than measureable doses...And for those of you that think that using homeopathy and herbalism to the exclusion of seeing someone who knows what they are talking about: http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,22706946-5001021,00.html



You are confusing nutritional medicine with homeopathic. And that is still a long way to go to the 780,000 that die due to Allopathy in the uSA every year.
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barefoot1

187 Posts

Posted - 11/07/2007 :  12:46:48  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by commonsense
[ However, given advancements in medical science in the last 100 years, the efficacy of homeopathy versus conventional medicine can no longer be described as comparable.



HA very true allopathic drugs kill hundreds of thousands each now while homeopathy still harms no none.
The most likey person to kill you statistically is a member of the medical profession and thats an indisputable fact.
Energy and quantum healing is the future and the barbaric murderous allopathic drug pushers who can only treat symptoms and not causation are still in the dark ages.
Doctors who have not a clue about environmental chemical and toxic causes of disease and just prescible drugs with nasty side effects are barbarians compared to quantum and energy healers and do not have a future in the long term.


Big Pharma and their puppets in Government are the biggest threat to your families health and well being while they pretend to be the opposite.
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Hannah

United Kingdom
84 Posts

Posted - 11/07/2007 :  13:01:36  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
quote:
Originally posted by commonsense

And for those of you that think that using homeopathy and herbalism to the exclusion of seeing someone who knows what they are talking about:

http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,22706946-5001021,00.html



What a sad story. But I'm afraid that does not prove that either homeopathy or allopathic medicine works. The article mentions that the child was malnourished and we don't hear what (if any) vaccines she may have had. The article does not give enough details to prove anything.

Now if you want to print a list and give details of all the iatrogenic deaths in either the US, Australia or the UK, that could be very interesting. Perhaps not, as it may crash this website.....

Hannah
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GUS THE FUSS

United Kingdom
1469 Posts

Posted - 11/07/2007 :  13:16:42  Show Profile  Visit GUS THE FUSS's Homepage  Reply with Quote
• Here you go trolls having used all to great effect I vouch for everything non NHS haven’t been to a NHS doctor Gp or otherwise fo 24 years,speaks for itself? Like your style Jonathan something or other, resembles mine. Try and think for yourself it is very hard we know that but do try instead of thinking the programme Pharma as installed in you .Here look up QXCI machines George Bush and his father uses it and all the Astronauts use it as well. Invented by Professor William Nelson his work on Apollo 13 is essential in helping the astronauts re-set the navigation system for re-entry.
http://www.theqxci.com/qxci_nelson.html


Vibrational Medicine is based on the principle that all living beings have a unique vibrational frequency. When this frequency is out of balance then a dis – eased state arises. Even the common cold or backache is a result of this energetic imbalance. Vibrational Medicine is helpful in a huge range of conditions from acute to chronic and severe. This Is a completely holistic and safe therapy to achieve a state of wellbeing.
Vibrational Medicine uses body dowsing, meridians, muscle testing, nutrition, homeopathy and physical therapies. Uniquely, low potency homeopathic preparations in tablet form are placed on key points of the body. The energy imparted to the body will then help bring destructive patterns that have manifested, be it physically, mentally, emotionally or spiritually, into balance. Disharmony is brought into harmony deep within the self.
This therapy is a meeting between the western and eastern forms of traditional healing.
The remedies are sourced worldwide for their unique healing properties. They originate from plant, mineral, numerology and ancient healing stone circle sources.
Remedies are placed via homeopathic tablets on to key meridian points to feed the vibrational information into the body's energetic system. In some cases toxins are drawn out of the body.

EnergyYour body has energy continuously moving through it, creating a dynamic energy field. This body-field can be viewed at many levels, at its simplest it is both the internal and external aura. As a practitioner, it can be considered as the energetic field which homeopathic remedies, acupuncture needles and healers are able to effect. In biochemical terms, the body-field is the supra-chemical system which acts as the master control for all metabolism and growth.
Vit C is used diluted in homeopathic treatments?

ANYTHING ELSE TROLLS THAT WILL HELP YOU PLEASE ASK AS YOU CANT THINK FOR YOUR SELFS...
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commonsense

178 Posts

Posted - 11/07/2007 :  16:46:45  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
So how does Vitamin C uniquely interact with this 'bio-field' where other molecules cannot? What are the exact chemical, biological and quantum mechanisms?

cs
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barefoot1

187 Posts

Posted - 11/07/2007 :  19:01:46  Show Profile  Reply with Quote
[quote]Originally posted by commonsense

So how does Vitamin C uniquely interact with this 'bio-field' where other molecules cannot? What are the exact chemical, biological and quantum mechanisms?

Until you comment on the millions of Iatrogenic deaths which you dont seem very keen to do why on earth should we get invloved in such a dumb argument as nutrition v allopathic drugs which is no brainer.
Do you condone these deaths from your beloved allopaths? or do you just turn a blind eye and pretend it does happen like a sociopath would or a drug Company or health official. Does it bother you at all?
Most normal people would be horrified to find out what barbaric practices pass of as modern medicine and that a doctor is the most likley person to kill them. You can't defend the indefendable so you attack on petty little things to appease your ego and indoctrinated and brainwashed beliefs and how you despise us free thinkers who refuse to be conditioned and indoctrinated into a medical mafia of horror and death and the $$$ickness industry.
Paid trolls no doubt post on here just to troll and try to descredit truth seekers and your lack of empathy and refusal to comment on the MIILIONS OF IATROGENIC DEATHS tells us all we need to know.


Big Pharma and their puppets in Government are the biggest threat to your families health and well being while they pretend to be the opposite.

Edited by - barefoot1 on 11/07/2007 19:21:22
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GUS THE FUSS

United Kingdom
1469 Posts

Posted - 11/07/2007 :  19:57:10  Show Profile  Visit GUS THE FUSS's Homepage  Reply with Quote
[/No commonsense i
The answer is partly scientific and partly cultural. The mechanism of action of homeopathically prepared drugs has never been understood and the dominant biomolecular model finds the ultra-high dilutions used in homeopathy to be completely baffling, or even irrational. However, there are some striking findings emerging from research of ultra-high dilutions that are beginning to challenge the assumption that such substances cannot exert a biological effect. The cultural answer to the controversy is that homeopathy has always represented a professional challenge to the established practice of medicine which is of course why you No –commonsense are so anti homeopathy. You could also go to a QXCI practioner and see by use of mapping how the vit c would react in some people but each person is very different unlike allopathic one size fits al ..duh.
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john

United Kingdom
608 Posts

Posted - 11/07/2007 :  20:43:22  Show Profile  Visit john's Homepage  Send john an AOL message  Reply with Quote
"Avoiding the question again john? How do the mechanisms differ?"

Don't have the slightest idea or slightest interest in finding out.

You are just distracting from the fact vitamin C cures where drugs don't. If you are interested (yeah right) then read the reams churned out by orthomolecular doctors and scientists.

"For every drug that benefits a patient, there is a natural substance that can achieve the same effect." — Pfeiffer's Law

without killing the patient.

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